Castle Lords Questions / Die Burgherren Fragen

[StanoL]

Hi,
I really like Castle Lords expansion and I have several questions to this expansion. Problem is that author of this expansion Trebuchet is not available for a while more than 5 years and he had also blocked private messages on CarcC.

I saw here that some of you have some experience with this expansions and here are my questions:

Basic rules of placement and here becomes my first question
* Castle Lords tile can be placed in regular rules
* When placed meeple, you can place is on Castle, and then meeple become Castle Lord and controls road.

Does it mean, that when placed on castle you place meeple also on road and then road is occupied by your Castle Lord?
- I suppose that yes

As this question is crucial, then I will follow other question but need to know, if I understand original rules correctly.

Thanks

(Those question are for future JCloisterZone add-on )

=====

Hallo,
Ich mag Castle Lords Erweiterung wirklich und ich habe mehrere Fragen zu dieser Erweiterung. Das Problem ist, dass der Autor dieser Erweiterung Trebuchet ist nicht verfügbar für eine Weile mehr als 5 Jahren und er hatte auch blockiert private Nachrichten auf CarcC.

Ich habe hier gesehen, dass einige von euch Erfahrung mit diesen Erweiterungen haben und hier sind meine Fragen:

Grundregeln der Platzierung und hier wird meine erste Frage
* Castle Lords Plättchen können nach den normalen Regeln platziert werden.
* Wenn man einen Meeple platziert, kann man ihn auf der Burg platzieren, und dann wird der Meeple zum Burgherrn und kontrolliert die Straße.

Bedeutet das, dass man, wenn man einen Meeple auf einer Burg platziert, diesen auch auf der Straße platziert und die Straße dann von seinem Burgherrn besetzt wird?
- Ich nehme an, dass ja.

Da diese Frage von entscheidender Bedeutung ist, werde ich die anderen Fragen beantworten, muss aber wissen, ob ich die ursprünglichen Regeln richtig verstanden habe.

Danke

(Diese Fragen sind für das zukünftige JCloisterZone Add-on )

Übersetzt mit www.DeepL.com/Translator (kostenlose Version)

[Fritz_Spinne]

I first loooked at the rules and my thoughts are:

The Castle Lord expansion is about scoring a road with more points. If you look at the graphics, there is a field, a castle and a road. But you can place your follower only regularly on the field or - according to new rules - on the castle. Why not on the road itself?

In the text to the first example picture is said "played as per normal rules to an unoccupied road". In the second example: "The road is now a castle road and occupied by red." (Red follower is the Castle Lord).

In the footnote there are two things: If one castle road (occupied by player A) is joined with another castle road (occupied by player B), then the majority rules will be applied. And if a you close a castle road with another castle, the road will be scored.

My conclusion, though it's not literally in the text:
You cannot place a Castle Lord, if you place the road of the Castle Lord tile to an occupied road - the castle is only a special end of the road and you cannot occupy a road, if there is a follower on it.

I think, there are two things missing in the rules:
How to score a regular road with a follower on it, which is closed by a Castle (without Lord), because you cannot place a Lord on it. I think like a regular road.
What to do, if you join a castle road (with Castle Lord) with an existing road without castle, but with follower(s).
For example, if there is one Castle Lord of Red and two followers of Green on the road - who will get points? My proposal: first of all the majority rules decide, who gets points.
If a player's followers on the road have the majority, the player gets the regular road points. If the Castle Lords of a player have the majority, the player gets the castle road points. If two or more players have the same number of followers on the road or on castles, the player with castles gets the castle road points, the player with followers on the road gets regular road points.
Special problem: Player A has one follower on the road and one Castle Lord at the end, Player B has two followers on the road - how will you score this? There are some miniexpansions which make it possible to have such configurations, e.g. ferries, labyrinth.

[Fritz_Spinne]

Now I looked over the posts in the old CarC forum, there I had asked a few questions and trebuchet answered:

Quote from: Fritz_Spinne on July 04, 2013, 02:39:02 PM
Can you occupy the Castle if there is a robber on the road already?
Can you occupy the Castle if you place the Castle tile extending an already occupied Castle Road?
No, the Castle Road is to be regarded as a normal road, so basic rules apply.

Quote from: Fritz_Spinne on July 04, 2013, 02:39:02 PM
If the Castle is not occupied, can it be occupied using the magic portal or the flyer?
Sure, as long as the road is not yet occupied.
[/quote]

So it is clear a castle is only a piece of the road and you cannot occupy it, if the road is already occupied. But for the special scoring questions there are no answers.

[StanoL]

Thank so If I read it correctly, than Castle Lords is about road, so Castle Lord role is only when Meeple placed on first tile with Castle. So for simplification castle is part of road.

So I think we can continue.

Rules said that extra bonus for Castle Lord role is not given, when road is ended with another Castle Lord Tile.
Question 2:
What if on road is Roundabout or Labyrinth and road have more than 2 end?
By my understanding of rules answer can be:
Any road with two Castle ends not give to Castle Lord bonus. So for Labyrinth with 4 end, when 2 end end with Castle (from this expansion), then is scored as regular road.

Another part of rules said when join castle road with existing road with meeple, then road is not castle road, and road is scored as regular road by majority.

I think basic rules are now clear.

So:
Question 3:
When combined only with Basic Game, then Castle Lord rules for scoring of road can apply only when these condition are granted:
1. Road contains only one of Castle Lord tile
2. Road has only one meeple and this meeple is placed on Castle Lord tile as Castle Lord role

Is it correct?

PS: Question for another expansions will come

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Danke, also wenn ich es richtig lese, dann geht es bei Castle Lords um die Straße, also ist die Rolle des Castle Lords nur, wenn Meeple auf dem ersten Plättchen mit der Burg steht. Zur Vereinfachung ist die Burg also Teil der Straße.

Ich denke also, wir können weitermachen.

Die Regeln besagen, dass es keinen zusätzlichen Bonus für die Rolle des Burgherrn gibt, wenn die Straße mit einem anderen Burgherrn-Plättchen beendet wird.
Frage 2:
Was ist, wenn eine Straße ein Kreisverkehr oder ein Labyrinth ist und mehr als 2 Enden hat?
Nach meinem Verständnis der Regeln kann die Antwort lauten:
Jede Straße mit zwei Burgenden gibt dem Burgherrn keinen Bonus. Wenn also bei einem Labyrinth mit 4 Enden 2 Enden mit einer Burg (aus dieser Erweiterung) enden, dann wird es wie eine normale Straße gewertet.

Ein anderer Teil der Regeln besagt, dass wenn man eine Burgstraße mit einer bestehenden Straße mit Meeple verbindet, dann ist die Straße keine Burgstraße und wird als normale Straße gewertet.

Ich denke, die Grundregeln sind jetzt klar.

Also:
Frage 3:
Wenn nur mit dem Grundspiel kombiniert, dann können die Regeln des Burgherrn für die Wertung der Straße nur angewendet werden, wenn diese Bedingungen erfüllt sind:
1. Die Straße enthält nur ein Burgherr-Plättchen
2. Die Straße hat nur einen Meeple und dieser Meeple wird auf das Schlossherrn-Plättchen als Schlossherrn-Rolle gelegt.

Ist das korrekt?

PS: Frage für andere Erweiterungen wird kommen

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[Fritz_Spinne]

I think your conclusions about castle roads with two or more followers are not right.

In the footnote there are two things: If one castle road (occupied by player A) is joined with another castle road (occupied by player B), then the majority rules will be applied. And if a you close a castle road with another castle, the road will be scored.
Majority rules say the majority of followers score, so: If a Castle Road with Red's Castle Lord is joined to the Casttle Road with Green's Castle Lord, both have one follower on the road and both score according to the Castle Road rules. They roads can join with a tile with road, roundabout, labyrinth, ferry, which was open and is now closed.
If you close an existing Castle Road (with Castle Lord) with a castle Road tile, you cannot place a follower on the castle, because the road is already occupied.

Until yet there are no rules from trebuchet for every other situation, especially when a road with follower (thief) is joined with an existing castle road. Because a thief on the road hinders to place a castle Lord and vice versa I think, it is probably the best solution to apply majority rules for all followers on the road, thieves and Castle Lords (1. expansion also big follower, 5. expansion also wagon). The player with majority scores applying the regular rules for roads, if he only thas thieves on the road, he scores applying the Castle Road rules, if he has one or more Castle Lords (Big Follower is two followers ...). In the case of two or more players having the same number of followers they score according to the role their followers have (thief/Castle Lord).

[StanoL]

Thanks @Fritz_Spinne you are right. I read rules wrong.

With Clarifications by Trebuchet you mentioned and found that original name for this expansion was trully Castle roads. then logic for score road can be:
1. Standard rules of majority apply when scoring road.
2. Road is scored as regular road doesn't matter if castle lords scoring rule will be applied for all owners of road.
3. For each owner will be checked if He has Castle Lord.
- 3. Yes - This player which meets conditions get extra Bonus for player
- 3. No - This player will not get extra Bonus for player
4. As Castle Lords bonus is defined for Player scoring Castle road. Castle Lords doesn't stack? Even if when road has for example two Castle Lords Tiles with same player meeple as Castle Lords?
5. In any future cases (for example two meeple same color as Castle Lord on same tile) Player can get Castle Lords bonus for each road only once?

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Danke @Fritz_Spinne du hast recht. Ich habe die Regeln falsch gelesen.

Bei den Erläuterungen von Trebuchet hast du erwähnt und herausgefunden, dass der ursprüngliche Name für diese Erweiterung wirklich Burgstraßen war. dann kann die Logik für die Wertungsstraße sein:
1. Es gelten die normalen Mehrheitsregeln für die Wertung von Straßen.
2. Die Straße wird wie eine normale Straße gewertet, unabhängig davon, ob die Burgherren-Regel für alle Besitzer der Straße gilt.
3. Für jeden Besitzer wird geprüft, ob er einen Burgherrn hat.
- 3. ja - Dieser Spieler, der die Bedingungen erfüllt, erhält einen zusätzlichen Bonus für den Spieler.
- 3. nein - Dieser Spieler erhält keinen zusätzlichen Bonus für den Spieler
4. Der Bonus für den Burgherrn wird für den Spieler definiert, der die Burgstraße punktet. Castle Lords ist nicht stapelbar? Auch wenn die Straße z.B. zwei Burgherrenplättchen mit demselben Spieler als Burgherren hat?
5. In allen zukünftigen Fällen (z.B. zwei gleichfarbige Meeple als Castle Lords auf demselben Plättchen) kann der Spieler den Castle Lords Bonus für jede Straße nur einmal erhalten?


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[Snearone]

Code: Alles auswählen

In the event that a Castle Road is joined with an existing Castle Road but remains unfinished, standard rules for majority
apply

This could be a typo, at the time of Castle Lords release (July 2013) if I'm not mistaken there were only two tiles from the official expansions that allowed multiple roads to be combined into one so it wouldn't be completed having multiple branches thus allowing multiple castles to be present, a small roundabout from 5 (Mayor) and a large roundabout from 7 (Catapult).

The specified situation is an extreme case and it is strange that the author focused on it and not on describing what happens when the castle road is connected to the normal road that is already occupied.

It is also worth focusing on this sentence:

Code: Alles auswählen

1. When a Castle Tile is used to end an opponent’s Castle Road, normal rules apply for ending roads.

The same term is also used when describing an end game situation:

Code: Alles auswählen

Uncompleted Castle Roads are counted as per normal rules at the end of the game.

So by ending your opponent's Castle Road with other Castle Road, the normal rules apply, not the Castle Lords rules, no extra points for it being the Castle Road.

Back to the first issue. For example:
Normal red meeple on castle, big blue meeple on joined road.
According to the rules, at the end of the game, normal road points are scored by blue.
But what happens if this road is closed, lets assume it's 4 tiles long?
By logic blue will get 4 points for having majority and being on normal road.
Situation reverses, now there is big red meeple on castle, small blue on joined road.
Red wins majority, should it get 10 points with Castle Road bonus?
And now situation when red have normal meeple on castle, blue have normal meeple on joined road.
Blue gets 4 points, and red gets 10 points?

So the rules are not complete, making this expansion very unclear.
If I would play it, for even better balancing it, Castle Roads should give extra points only when it is occupied by the Castle Lord, so no other meeples present, if any joins than it's not special anymore, so treated as normal road.

[Fritz_Spinne]

It is also worth focusing on this sentence:
1. When a Castle Tile is used to end an opponent’s Castle Road, normal rules apply for ending roads.

I think normal rules for ending/closing the road, but not for scoring the Castle Road.

And yes, there are rules missing! At that time, everyone could put everything in the download section without control ...

[StanoL]

It is also worth focusing on this sentence:
1. When a Castle Tile is used to end an opponent’s Castle Road, normal rules apply for ending roads.

I think normal rules for ending/closing the road, but not for scoring the Castle Road.

And yes, there are rules missing! At that time, everyone could put everything in the download section without control ...

Agree with @Snearone.
There is used: When a Castle Tile is used to end an opponent’s Castle Road - this is like protection against Castle road bonus, but ending with: normal rules apply for ending roads..
This "ending roads" of this rule has no sense. I think that Author want to write that rules for ending roads, means scoring. So better will be normal rules apply for scoring roads.

So final sentence will be:
When a Castle Tile is used to end an opponent’s Castle Road, normal rules apply for scoring roads.

Does it have sense?

====

Es lohnt sich auch, auf diesen Satz zu achten:
1. Wenn ein Burgplättchen verwendet wird, um eine gegnerische Burgstraße zu beenden, gelten die normalen Regeln für das Beenden von Straßen

.
Ich denke, die normalen Regeln für das Beenden/Schließen der Straße, aber nicht für die Wertung der Burgstraße.

Und ja, es gibt Regeln, die fehlen! Damals konnte jeder alles ohne Kontrolle in den Downloadbereich stellen ...

Stimme mit @Snearone überein.
Es wird verwendet: Wenn ein Burgplättchen verwendet wird, um eine gegnerische Burgstraße zu beenden - das ist wie ein Schutz gegen den Burgstraßenbonus, aber mit einem Ende: Es gelten die normalen Regeln für das Beenden von Straßen.
Das "Beenden von Straßen" in dieser Regel hat keinen Sinn. Ich denke, dass der Autor schreiben will, dass Regeln für endende Straßen, Punkte bedeuten. Besser wäre also normale Regeln gelten für Punkterouten.

Der letzte Satz wird also lauten:
Wenn ein Burgplättchen verwendet wird, um eine gegnerische Burgstraße zu beenden, gelten die normalen Regeln für Wertungsstraßen.

Ergibt das einen Sinn?

[StanoL]

Well. I remember what tolld me @kettlefish when we spoke about rules when solving some issues about Watchtowers and Fruit-Bearing Trees mini expansions. It was something like 'Think in Carcassonne vocabulary and find to meet Carcassonne mechanics.
When we going back to problematic sentence:

When a Castle Tile is used to end an opponent’s Castle Road, normal rules apply for ending roads.

Here are some arguments, why this is not "Anti bonus score mechanics"
1. In regular rules of Road is written, that Road is ending by Junction / Village or Monastery. So this means, that road can be ended also by other Castle Lord tile.
2. There is no such mechanics in Carcassonne, when two mechanics in one feature have negative approach for scoring. At least they do not stack, like Inn, Same road ended in German Castle, Cathedral, 2 Besiegers city segments of same city. etc.

So for simplicity of rules following known standards, I'm for @Fritz_Spinne approach.
1. Castle road as Road
2. When scoring Road Majority approach is used.
3b. Player with Majority on Castle road and meeple as Castle Lord can get extra bonus for Castle road
3b. Player with Majority on Castle road which don't have meeple as Castle Lord will score only road.
4. For future scoring like Castle (Expansion 8) value to value of Road is not counting Castle Lord bonus, because it's bonus for player.

What do you think?

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Nun ja. Ich erinnere mich, was mir @kettlefish sagte, als wir über Regeln sprachen, als wir einige Probleme mit den Mini-Erweiterungen Wachtürme und Fruchttragende Bäume lösten. Es war so etwas wie: "Denke in Carcassonne-Vokabeln und finde heraus, wie die Carcassonne-Mechanik funktioniert.
Wenn wir auf den problematischen Satz zurückkommen:
[Zitat]
Wenn ein Burgplättchen verwendet wird, um eine gegnerische Burgstraße zu beenden, gelten die normalen Regeln für das Beenden von Straßen.
[/quote]
Hier sind einige Argumente, warum dies keine "Anti-Bonuspunkte-Mechanik" ist
1. In den regulären Straßenregeln steht, dass eine Straße durch eine Kreuzung / ein Dorf oder ein Kloster beendet wird. Das bedeutet also, dass die Straße auch durch ein anderes Burgherrenplättchen beendet werden kann.
2. In Carcassonne gibt es keine solche Mechanik, bei der zwei Mechaniken in einem Spielzug einen negativen Ansatz für die Wertung haben. Zumindest sind sie nicht stapelbar, wie z.B. Gasthaus, dieselbe Straße, die in einer deutschen Burg endet, Kathedrale, 2 Belagerer-Stadtsegmente derselben Stadt usw.

Der Einfachheit halber und den bekannten Standards folgend, bin ich für @Fritz_Spinne Ansatz.
1. Burgstraße als Straße
2. Bei der Wertung von Straßen wird der Mehrheitsansatz verwendet.
3b. Spieler mit Mehrheit auf der Burgstraße und Meeple als Burgherr können einen zusätzlichen Bonus für die Burgstraße erhalten.
3b. Spieler mit Mehrheit auf der Burgstraße, die keinen Meeple als Burgherrn haben, erhalten nur die Straße.
4. Für zukünftige Wertungen wie die Burg (Erweiterung 8) wird der Wert der Straße nicht mit dem Bonus des Burgherrn verrechnet, da es ein Bonus für den Spieler ist.

Was meint ihr dazu?

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[StanoL]

Ok. I think about creating revisited rules which can consider it and make this expansion more "Carcassone-like"
===
Ok. Ich denke darüber nach, überarbeitete Regeln zu erstellen, die dies berücksichtigen und diese Erweiterung mehr "Carcassone-isch" machen können.

[Challa007]

Hi everybody,
I am a little late to the party but I am also interested, so I just downloaded the original rules from Trebuchet and here are my comments:

If you really stick very closely to every word, graphic and example in the rules and later explanations, then most of your questions are already answered by Trebuchet himself, StanoL. And I don't think that there are any mistakes in the rules, Snearone.

In reality the 4 castle lord tiles are all featuring 2 features: a field and a road. The castle is only a specialty of the road which enables to make the road a castle road.

Does it mean, that when placed on castle you place meeple also on road and then road is occupied by your Castle Lord?

Yes, because the castle IS the road

Next thing to consider is that only the player who has a meeple on a castle road tile (= the castle lord) can get the castle road points.
So in the whole game there can only be 4 castle lords!
Apart from that, Trebuchet has repeatedly mentioned that a castle road is first and primarily a road where normal road rules apply.
So if this castle road is joined with a normal road, then first and primarily normal majority rules apply.
If majority says that a "normal" player has majority, then that player will get normal points. (clear)
If majority says that the castle lord player has the majority, then that player will get the castle lord points. (clear)
If both have same majority, then one gets normal points, the other gets castle lord points. (this could be point for discussion).

So yes, Snearone:

Back to the first issue. For example:
Normal red meeple on castle, big blue meeple on joined road.
According to the rules, at the end of the game, normal road points are scored by blue.
But what happens if this road is closed, lets assume it's 4 tiles long?
By logic blue will get 4 points for having majority and being on normal road.
Situation reverses, now there is big red meeple on castle, small blue on joined road.
Red wins majority, should it get 10 points with Castle Road bonus?
And now situation when red have normal meeple on castle, blue have normal meeple on joined road.
Blue gets 4 points, and red gets 10 points?

Exactly! And this is exactly the mecanism of this expansion -> that you can make HUGE amounts of points if you have the castle lord.
Trebuchet knew this and this is why he mentioned in one footnote at the end of the rules:

"Players should be able to prevent an opponent’s Castle Road to become very long by ending that road in their own turn, granting the opponent a certain score obviously. Also a limit in score can be agreed upon on forehand if desired."

Next point:

There is used: When a Castle Tile is used to end an opponent’s Castle Road - this is like protection against Castle road bonus, but ending with: normal rules apply for ending roads..
This "ending roads" of this rule has no sense. I think that Author want to write that rules for ending roads, means scoring. So better will be normal rules apply for scoring roads.

So final sentence will be:
When a Castle Tile is used to end an opponent’s Castle Road, normal rules apply for scoring roads.

Does it have sense?

No, StanoL, what you wrote does not make any sense but what Trebuchet wrote makes sense:

What Trebuchets wants to say is:

Example: Imagine you have a castle lord road that is already very long and belongs to an opponent player. Obviously you do not want him to get more and more points so you look for the next opportunity to end his road.
Unfortunately, the next tile you draw that will allow to end his road is a castle road tile.
In that case, well, you place the castle road tile but, obviously, you cannot place a castle lord because the road is already occupied. So in this case the castle lord tile is just another tile that ends a road (so normal rules of road ending apply, meaning: a road is ended so you have to score it).
It really is just this, nothing more to read into it.

So yes, StanoL, there is no such thing here as "Anti bonus score mechanics" to read into it.

Here are some arguments, why this is not "Anti bonus score mechanics"
1. In regular rules of Road is written, that Road is ending by Junction / Village or Monastery. So this means, that road can be ended also by other Castle Lord tile.

This means I also agree with your final conclusion:

So for simplicity of rules following known standards, I'm for @Fritz_Spinne approach.
1. Castle road as Road
2. When scoring Road Majority approach is used.
3a. Player with Majority on Castle road and meeple as Castle Lord can get extra bonus for Castle road
3b. Player with Majority on Castle road which don't have meeple as Castle Lord will score only road.
4. For future scoring like Castle (Expansion 8) value to value of Road is not counting Castle Lord bonus, because it's bonus for player.

What do you think?

You only need to add
3c. When two players have equal majority on the road but one has castle lord, the player with castlelord will get castlelord points, the other player will get normal points.

Ok. I think about creating revisited rules which can consider it and make this expansion more "Carcassone-like"

I think it is only "clarification" of rules, it is already Carcassonne-like

But if you, Snearone, do not agree with these rules from Trebuchet, you can make your own variant (and maybe your own lovely tiles)

PS: as you have seen, I agree with everything that @Fritz_Spinne has written

[Snearone]

But if you, Snearone, do not agree with these rules from Trebuchet, you can make your own variant (and maybe your own lovely tiles)

It's not like I'm not agreeing, there is just too many missing information, and given rules are not precise enough as they are constructed weirdly.
I will pass on this one, too many not finished project already

[Fritz_Spinne]

PS: as you have seen, I agree with everything that @Fritz_Spinne has written

I too think, that the only Carcassonne-like interpretation of trebuchets rules are ours ... But you have to look at rule text, examples and footnotes. This should be made better in the text alone with additional examples, not only in footnotes.

For the new version we should look at official expansions which interact with the Castle Road. many quisteion could be avoided with "Every meeple which can be placed on a road can also placed as Castle Lord. A Castle Lord is treated like every other Meeple on the road (e.g. eaten by the dragon)."

Big expanisons:
1. What if an Inn is at the Castle Road? Double points or simply 1 point extra for every tile? Big meeple for the Castle Road?
2. Bulder on a Castle Road? I think "Yes".
3. Does the dragon eat Castle Lords? Can you teleport a meeple on the Castle Road?
4. Can the Castle Lord be captured with a tower?
6. Does a brigde fit over the Castle?
...

Mini-expanions
Flyer: Can a flying meeple end as Castle Lord
Ferries: How does the ferries interact with a CDastle Road?
...

[Challa007]

I too think, that the only Carcassonne-like interpretation of trebuchets rules are ours ... But you have to look at rule text, examples and footnotes. This should be made better in the text alone with additional examples, not only in footnotes.

I agree

For the new version we should look at official expansions which interact with the Castle Road. many quisteion could be avoided with "Every meeple which can be placed on a road can also placed as Castle Lord. A Castle Lord is treated like every other Meeple on the road (e.g. eaten by the dragon)."

I agree

Big expanisons:
1. What if an Inn is at the Castle Road? Double points or simply 1 point extra for every tile? Big meeple for the Castle Road?

I would say:
if the castle road is owned by a "normal" meeple: 2 points per tile as per normal rules,
if the castle road is owned by the castle lord: castle road rules do not change (so no doubel-ing)
the big meeple can be placed, normal rules of majority apply

2. Bulder on a Castle Road? I think "Yes".

Me too: yes

3. Does the dragon eat Castle Lords? Can you teleport a meeple on the Castle Road?

yes in both cases

4. Can the Castle Lord be captured with a tower?

yes

6. Does a brigde fit over the Castle?

hm, in this case I would say no

Mini-expanions
Flyer: Can a flying meeple end as Castle Lord

yes

Ferries: How does the ferries interact with a CDastle Road?

Normal rules of ferries apply, so roads can end suddenly or become longer suddenly.
But,in this case I think a mechanism is needed to make sure the castle lord scoring can only take place once.
(But normally it will anyway because after the scoring the castle lord returns to the player's supply). So at the moment I cannot think of a problem here...